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-   -   R50/R53/R55/R56 5 lug hub conversion kit (http://www.motoringunderground.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16950)

dark_S 10-12-2009 07:12 PM

R50/R53/R55/R56 5 lug hub conversion kit
 
what if?...

ok guys, 2 questions:
- how much would you pay for a direct bolt on hub conversion kit (new hubs) to change from 4x100 to 5x114.3? the idea is to sell new hubs so that the average DIYer can change the bolt pattern in their driveway. (is 5x114.3 a good choice for bolt pattern? if not, what would you make it?)
- would you like to change the offset? i think that to avoid a whole bunch of possible bearing issues, we would keep things as close to OEM as possible. ultimately, this is really a 'what wheels do you want to run' question.

please sound off. an engineer/fabricator friend of mine is thinking about making/selling 5 lug conversion kits for minis. if your thoughts on price jive with his thoughts on cost, this will probably start as a group buy before he can afford to just make and sell them normally.

Rally 10-12-2009 07:32 PM

As to how much I'd pay. I'd probably only pay around $500, maybe up to $600. Above that, and it would start making the wheel fitment just too unaffordable.

My thoughts:

-Adapters are now readily available (as thin as 18mm) to convert 4x100 to most 5 lug patterns for the first gen cars.
-As such, the target market may be the r56 crowd since there aren't any current adapter options. It'd also be nice for them to get away from the 14x1.25 lugs

-Price point is gonna be the main deciding factor I'd bet. Adapters are just $320 for all 4 corners. I could be wrong, but I'd imagine the hub conversion would be much more since you'd need new rotors, lugs, and stuff.

-Install would be a bit tough since our hubs are assembled and sold with the bearings pressed and stuff. Again, the adapters win at install ease.

-5x114 is good, 5x120 is another good one, 5x112 may be desirable for the euro crowd.

-The overall MINI market may not have enough demand. It's rare to find MINI owners who even care about wheels, let alone yearn for rare 5 lug wheels. Porsche adapters have been available since MINI's came out, and they've still only been used on a little less than 10 MINI's.

Sorry if it sounds like a bunch of negatives. I'm just trying to help out by playing devil's advocate. I love the idea of offering something like this.

Your friend should think about drop spindles if he wants to tinker around with our hubs ;). There's next to zero options for that so it's no competition. It also appeals to both track fiends, and euro slammed minis.

dark_S 10-12-2009 08:30 PM

- an 18mm adapter is 18mm more of lip you could have :P

- how much did it cost to fill/redrill your wheels? i figured that it could be a better one-time investment as it greatly opens the possible wheel selection. besides, a fill/redrill only works with wheels that have a center cap.

i'll talk to him about a drop spindle... see what he thinks. how much would you go? an inch? two?

it's not so much that he wants to get into mini parts. he feels he can provide quality parts that are missing from any car's catalog. he's been thinking about similar conversions for other cars.

Rally 10-12-2009 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dark_S (Post 518690)
- an 18mm adapter is 18mm more of lip you could have :P

Haha yah true. Though, if I get 5 lugs, I'm going for OEM Style wheels which usually have 50+ offsets.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dark_S (Post 518690)
- how much did it cost to fill/redrill your wheels? i figured that it could be a better one-time investment as it greatly opens the possible wheel selection. besides, a fill/redrill only works with wheels that have a center cap.

I think it was like 250- 300 bucks to redrill? I forget.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dark_S (Post 518690)
i'll talk to him about a drop spindle... see what he thinks. how much would you go? an inch? two?

I'm not sure, I'd have to investigate. Probably around 1"??. Just something to correct the control arm angles and tie rod angles.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dark_S (Post 518690)
it's not so much that he wants to get into mini parts. he feels he can provide quality parts that are missing from any car's catalog. he's been thinking about similar conversions for other cars.

More power to him. Quality parts outside the usual bolt-on realm of coilovers, intakes, and exhausts are so rare these days. I love to see anyone trying to introduce new stuff. :tu:

imspencerwithanR53 10-12-2009 08:46 PM

I would be interested in a Lug Hub conversion kit for sure. I've been looking at spacer/conversion because there is a larger market for 5 lug wheels.

Flamez 10-12-2009 09:38 PM

Agree with Rally. Cost is the deciding factor ($500 or less preferable). I'd take a set, particularly if they convert back to the 12mm lug thread pitch of the R50/R53. I'd vote for 5x112.

Chase 10-12-2009 09:49 PM

I would take a set for sure if the price was right. its so much easier to find baller wheels in 5 lug

Pobsey 10-12-2009 10:39 PM

5x120 could be cool, loads of 17 / 18" bbs split rims out there

coendek 10-12-2009 10:47 PM

I'dd also take a set. adapters are 18mm and about 300euro's in the netherlands. Mine were custom made and 5x130-4x100 for the R56.. I also needed bolts.. so 350 I guess..

BUT I feel safer with no adapter.. This is the reason why I am redrilling the wheel. I wish an other wheel hub was possible or ready, then I didn't had to redrill the BBS.. I think in The Netherlands you need to think about 2-5 sets I guess.. if the price is right.

The only problem, or the OTHER problem is, shipping. Those hubs will weigh a few K's so shipping wont be cheap.

So..

I'dd buy them for the next reasons:
-More wheel options because of bolt pattern
-More wheel options because of ET (with adapters)
-safer feeling
-keeping the wheels original (instead of drilling)

Reasons not to buy:
-expensive... ?
-hard to change hubs... ?


If I look at the things above.. I'll prob. buy a set if those question marks are answered with positive answers...

Thanks for dropping A PM Mike!

:tu:

keep it up!

Coen

Wake|MCS 10-13-2009 01:28 AM

Price is right, I'd take a set eventually. 5x120 or 5x112

imspencerwithanR53 10-13-2009 01:57 AM

We need to take a poll of what size/sizes people would like. If the price is right I am for sure in.

Drew 10-13-2009 02:28 AM

We had talked about this before and from what I remember looking into then I don't see how he could produce it for $500 or so. You're looking at having to change out 4 hubs and 4 rotors... probably going to have to do it with the bearings installed already so that it's a bolt-on application. I think it's an awesome idea though so I'm not against it at all! :tu:

Rally 10-13-2009 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew (Post 518837)
We had talked about this before and from what I remember looking into then I don't see how he could produce it for $500 or so. You're looking at having to change out 4 hubs and 4 rotors... probably going to have to do it with the bearings installed already so that it's a bolt-on application. I think it's an awesome idea though so I'm not against it at all! :tu:

That's my main concern too. He probably knows way more than I do...but from a spectators stand point, it almost seems like it's gonna be upwards of $900+ when all is said and done.
The hubs and bearings are expensive by themselves, then you're adding all new (custom?) rotors. Just seems like it will all add up if you're presenting a bolt-on application that doesn't require pressing all the bearings/hubs.

If it gets up to 900, and you add that to the 1000-1500 that it costs to buy baller 5 lug wheels, you start entering custom wheel price ranges where you could just order whatever wheel you want in 4x100.

imspencerwithanR53 10-13-2009 03:09 AM

More like 1500-4k baller wheels ha ha.

If we were to use say, WRX rotors which are 5x114 or our own supplied rotors it would be cheaper. So If a person wanted this done they could supply their own rotors if they wanted to go BBK or stock size...?

Rally 10-13-2009 03:11 AM

Hahaha if you're paying 2000+ for wheels, 90% of the time you could just have them supplied in 4x100 to your custom specs. JLines, CCW, HRE, DPE, iforged, Image,etc.

And let's be honest....there are maybe 10 MINI's out there running wheels that cost $1600+ :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by imspencerwithanR53 (Post 518849)

If we were to use say, WRX rotors which are 5x114 or our own supplied rotors it would be cheaper.

I'm not sure it's that easy? You'd have to find a car that happened to share the exact same size rotors as us....or you'd have to start adapting in new calipers and pads which just turns into a massive undertaking. I doubt subaru rotors would just fit right in place of our rotors and work with our calipers.


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