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  #16  
Old 07-03-2006, 06:25 PM
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Look at TCE, StopTech, Wilwood, or DetroitTuned too. Might find a better balance of price/performance... Wilwood also offers a slightly smaller setup (in addition to the usual big big brake kit) allowing the use of a 15" rim with their four-pot calipers, nice to retain the option of smaller wheels for certain conditions.

Last edited by werD; 07-04-2006 at 01:05 AM..
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  #17  
Old 07-05-2006, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewmon
Look at TCE, StopTech, Wilwood, or DetroitTuned too. Might find a better balance of price/performance... Wilwood also offers a slightly smaller setup (in addition to the usual big big brake kit) allowing the use of a 15" rim with their four-pot calipers, nice to retain the option of smaller wheels for certain conditions.
Interesting. I was thinking JCW just because it fits with the stock. I like the wildwood BBK kit as well. I'm more or less concerned with the install... any tips?
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  #18  
Old 07-05-2006, 08:31 PM
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So, out of curiosity, what exactly are you looking to get out of your brake upgrades? Shorter stopping distances? Reduced fade? Bling?
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  #19  
Old 07-05-2006, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
Interesting. I haven't heard that little nugget before. Cool.
I changed to the bushings after the rubbers ones on the drivers side in the back stopped sliding and did a real number on one pad, i started hearing noise and checked the pads and one was just getting to the rivet, the other pad was 3/4 there...

an easy and usefull upgrade.
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  #20  
Old 07-05-2006, 09:23 PM
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  #21  
Old 07-05-2006, 10:40 PM
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I have an awesome supplier for Goodridge brake lines, if anyone is interested. Final price shipped should be less than TireRack Wholesale.
I will not comment on whether they make any difference or not, it is a matter of your personal driving ability and style and track vs street, etc.
--Dan
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  #22  
Old 07-06-2006, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iDiaz
So, out of curiosity, what exactly are you looking to get out of your brake upgrades? Shorter stopping distances? Reduced fade? Bling?
I would be looking for shorter stopping distances.
-G
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  #23  
Old 07-06-2006, 02:53 PM
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Griff, I think a set of Hawk HPS pads are in order.
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  #24  
Old 07-06-2006, 02:57 PM
gandini gandini is offline
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When I ordered my BBK from TCE, Todd told me that my braking distances would not shorten appreciably. However, under extreme conditions of the kind at autocross or track days, a BBK would delay fade markedly. I paid a small fortune for big brakes, what did I get?
1. Impressive bling factor
2. Improved brake pedal feel and modulation
3. Resistance to, and delay of fade
4. Reasonable reduction in rotating, unsprung weight
5. About the same amount of brake dust as ceramic pads
6. Worse cold-start braking

That's my experience. Of course, I LOVE my big brakes! ha

cheers,
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  #25  
Old 07-06-2006, 04:06 PM
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Ding, winner.

Gandini pegs the usual results of adding BBK on a street car.

Results will always vary according to one's driving habits and the equipment used. There are a hundred ways to argue or discuss the finer details of brake parts but, generally speaking the resistance to fade is the big plus on BBK kits - they take a beating and keep providing consistent results.


For the occassional track day and routine street driving, investing in good pads (like Hawk or Axxis pads), lines, bushings, fluid, and some slotted rotors will typically meet the need.

Opinions and mileage may vary, but that's what I've experienced and why I bought exactly what I noted. StopTech slotted rotors, Axxis pads, Goodridge lines, and soon some bushings.

Those parts were less than half of a typical BBK kit (not including any labor time if needed for others) and I'll hopefully be able to use that $$$ saved on other goodies under the skin (rear bar, new pipes, etc.).That will suffice until I figure out if I can keep my 'Coop and if I will make it more of a track toy (then it will get a BBK to keep everything in shape circling the track).

However, nothing tops the looks of a BBK kit stuffed inside a wheel.

For what it is worth, a good BBK kit is pretty easy to install. The exception is the brake line replacement, but that is only complicated by the bleeding of old fluid and replacing. A power bleeder makes it mucho easier, sadly I don;t have one and hope to find a "loaner" to allow me to do my upgrade very soon.
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  #26  
Old 07-06-2006, 11:38 PM
brownMINI brownMINI is offline
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I did some track driving last weekend. I've got stock calipers and hoses; stock size, unslotted, undrilled, cryo-treated rotors (not worth the cost over just plain old stock rotors); and Motul RBF-600 fluid (better than ATE Super Blue). In the past, I've used Hawk HPS pads all around for street and track. On this track, those pads would only last 3 full laps. The track is extremely hard on brakes. Towards the end of the third lap, braking would start to get inconsistent. On the fourth lap, they would dissappear.

Last weekend, same track, only difference was Ferodo DS3000 front pads (track only pads). They are so much better on the track that Hawk HPS pads. You woulnd't want to use the DS3000s on the street, though.
The Ferodo DS3000 had a little more brake force - I'd trigger the ABS during the first few brake applications and was able to move my braking points out by 15 feet easily (one brake marker cone further). The kicker was that the brakes stayed that good for 5 laps. I didn't have to adjust my braking points, they just kept working. On the 6th lap, they'd start to get the "hot brake" smell and fade just a touch, so that was when I went into cool-down procedure.

If you have the time to swap brake pads for track use, I highly recommend it. A real race pad is so much more confidence inspiring than a compromise street / race pad.

I also dropped my personal best time for the track from a 1:02.9 to a 1:02.3 I'm not sure how much of that can be attributed to the brake pads, and how much was me just getting to be a better driver. But I'm sure the pads are worth some of that time drop. Not a bad time decrease for less than $200.

To sum it up... in my opinion for track use - as good a fluid as you need to avoid boiling (either ATE Super Blue or Motul RBF 600), stock rotors and calipers, race pads up front, compromise street / race pads in back, SS lines if you have some extra money left over.

Of course, if I had $1000 laying around, I'd have a Wilwood / TCE brake kit on the front of my car, even if just to make the brake pad change easier.
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  #27  
Old 07-07-2006, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simplygriff
I would be looking for shorter stopping distances.
-G
Well, there's one thing that everyone failed to mention that will shorten your stopping distances considerably, and it's got nothing to do with pads or big brake kits: TIRES!

Chances are, your existing brake setup produces enough torque to lock up the brakes at the speed range you're likely looking to improve upon (canyon/autocross). Brake lock-up occurs when the tires provide insufficient grip to meet the stopping demands of the brakes. Maximum braking force is generated right before lock-up, a condition commonly known as "impending lock-up braking". If you're capable of producing lock-up at most of the speeds you're driving at, upgrading brake parts will not improve stopping distances whatsoever, in the case of a single braking application.

Swap in a set of stickier tires, and you'll see the shorter stopping distances you're looking for, without ever swapping out any brake parts. That said, higher speeds and/or stickier tires will require stronger brake torque to reach impending lock-up, so until you have trouble reaching impending lock-up, don't bother with brake modifications. That is, unless you're interested in other matters such as improved pedal feel or reduced brake fade. Those two improvements are really the only reasons to upgrade the brakes on a street/canyon/autocross car. If you want improved pedal feel, try an aggressive pad such as the Ferodo DS2500 or Hawk HP+. Braided, stainless steel brake lines (Ireland Engineering) and rigid caliper bushings (Tyrolsport) will also improve pedal feel. If you're looking to reduce brake fade, which is most commonly caused by boiled fluid, try a high-temperature street/track fluid such as ATE Super Blue or Motul RBF600.
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  #28  
Old 02-08-2007, 07:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CANYON MINI View Post
My pedal is much firmer since I installed stainless steel brake hoses front & rear. Great mod. you can feel, for under 100 bucks!
I need to get this done to my MINI pretty soon. Trying to swap out the brake fluid too, in prep for the upcoming BMWCCA AutoX season, here in SoCal. Where can I find the stainless brake line for under $100? Most of the ones I have seen are around $70 per pair. If you have a link or ph #, I would really appreciate it

-Jason
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  #29  
Old 02-08-2007, 08:35 PM
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Set of four for $78 from Ireland Engineering:

https://secure15.nexternal.com/share...t=products.asp

S'what I'm running, and they've held up without issue.
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  #30  
Old 02-09-2007, 03:35 AM
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Ive got em, but havent put them on yet
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