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  #1  
Old 06-07-2006, 10:34 PM
Abattoir Abattoir is offline
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Default brakes running to hot?

ok I did a touge run last (6-4-06) night, and took my handy little temperature gun to start compiling data for comparison for when ever I get upgraded brakes/tire etc.

when Im doing uphill runs the brakes are relatively cool (400~450f) becuase y'know gravity helped me out with the slowing down.

atmospheric temperature was 95f asphalt temp was 120f in direct sunlight and 100f in shade. I liked the traction I was getting.

but at the end of a downhill run I checked an my front brake rotors were 600f+ my temp gun only gets up to 600f and they were to hot to register...


is this bad?
were should i keep them at/below.

FYI: EVERYTHING is still stock. 04 accord 6speed v6
repost from a accord forum that i'm a member of as well.
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Old 06-07-2006, 10:53 PM
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Well one sign would have been if there was any smoke especially from the fronts . Most minis on stock pads will tend to smoke if you get too aggressive which we see constantly on one of our local down hill only roads. No lasting effect to speak of but a upgrade to a bettter pad might be in order. Seeing that you will rarely have worse ambient temperatures than what you had at that time if your brakes were not fading and there was no smoke then I think you are ok for now . I am sure you will get some other opinions shortly .

Randy
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  #3  
Old 06-07-2006, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmini
Well one sign would have been if there was any smoke especially from the fronts . Most minis on stock pads will tend to smoke if you get too aggressive which we see constantly on one of our local down hill only roads. No lasting effect to speak of but a upgrade to a bettter pad might be in order. Seeing that you will rarely have worse ambient temperatures than what you had at that time if your brakes were not fading and there was no smoke then I think you are ok for now . I am sure you will get some other opinions shortly .

Randy
M7 Tuning
he doesnt drive a mini

Were you experiencing any type of fade towards the end of your run? Mushy pedal syndrome?
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Old 06-07-2006, 11:22 PM
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Yeah, if you're not experiencing any brake fade, there shouldn't be a problem. Trust your foot, not your temperature gun.

BTW, does that Accord have rear drums?
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Old 06-08-2006, 12:16 AM
Abattoir Abattoir is offline
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oh man i don't remember if i was getting brake fade or not...

i have discs in the back.

Quote:
Most minis on stock pads will tend to smoke if you get too aggressive which we see constantly on one of our local down hill only roads
mine were quite smokey that's why i got out to check. are you talking about [edited] by chance, because that's the road that kills my brakes?
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Last edited by iDiaz; 06-08-2006 at 12:20 AM.. Reason: Removed road name.
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  #6  
Old 06-08-2006, 12:19 AM
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Arrow Another .02 cents of info

That might be worth all of .0000002 cents...

FWIW: If it is a 6spd V6 Accord, that's decent hardware and has discs all the way around.

iDiaz is pretty much on the money, don't fret too much about the temperature gun unless you are headed for some long hard driving, like at the track ('cause we never speed in public right ).

But you are on the right track thinking it is worthwhile to record rotor temps and tire temps. You will obviously need a temp gun that reads higher....

If you look at the effective or appropriate operating temperature of pads you can get an idea of how hot rotors get (and how much abuse your pads can take). For example, a set of Endless SS-S Sport pads operate best in the temperature range of 160-840 degrees fahrenheit. Below 160 you'll notice a pretty weak feel in the braking department - pads don't bite... And if you get above ~800 you'll notice things aren't feeling quite right when pounding the brakes - kinda' slime like. For what it is worth, if you get 'em glowing hot that puts the rotor temp somewhere north of the 1200F range and bad voodoo happens that usually results in damage to you and your street car...

This is where a temp gun comes into play. You can read the rotors and get a feel for what temps you are running on your favorite track or twisty - and then get a set of pads that match your habit/conditions. You may find that you need to switch pads to accomodate your driving habits (especially if you hit the track). Be sure to bed your pads each time you switch (regardless of previous use/bedding).

If you hammer your brakes excessively you can damage your rotors and destroy pads with the heat. The rotors can typically survive more heat then the pads, pads can crack apart or disintegrate if they are exposed to extreme temps. You can see the damage to rotors more easily, so remember to pull your pads and inspect after a hard set of runs (sucks to have pads crumble/crack away and suddenly no more brakes! ).

If you are running streetable pads you may want to investigate running more air into the caliper area to keep temps in an effective range while hammering backroads or getting track time. When done, you can block if needed to allow temps to return to normal on the street.

So, anyway through all of this babble you are probably just fine but be sure to take a peek at your pads and make sure they are holding up.

Others will certainly add more, but I hope this is useful info without getting too detailed or explaining what is already known.
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  #7  
Old 06-08-2006, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abattoir
oh man i don't remember if i was getting brake fade or not...

i have discs in the back.

mine were quite smokey that's why i got out to check. are you talking about [edited] by chance, because that's the road that kills my brakes?
If you weren't boiling the stock fluid (spongy brake pedal that isn't stopping as well as you think it should), you're probably not getting hot enough to hurt the pads. I wouldn't worry too much about the temperature read. Try using heel & toe downshifts, in order to ensure you're in the correct gear to take advantage of some engine braking.

BTW, I edited that road name out, but yes, that's one of the best places to test your brakes. That long downhill straightaway with the clearing and slight kink in it, followed by a strong brake zone with a double-downshift into a left-hander is especially brutal.
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Old 06-08-2006, 12:28 AM
Abattoir Abattoir is offline
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that's not to detailed for me.

and i see that i can't say the name of my favorite road... hmm interesting.
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Old 06-08-2006, 12:28 AM
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By the way, if you really want to get a good idea of what peak temperatures your brakes are operating at, this is the best way to do it:

http://www.raceshopper.com/temperature_paint.shtml

It's paint that changes color when a certain temperature has been reached, so you know what temperature your rotors are reaching during braking, not after you've driven for a bit and pulled over.
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Old 06-08-2006, 03:33 AM
battle cattle battle cattle is offline
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If your not getting any fade don't worry about it.... your brakes are running really hott... (in my opinion) I don't know how long this run is uphill or downhill but in 9miles on the dragon my rotors were around 389ish and caliper was floating around 430ish. Granted this is upgraded rotors, pads, and fluid
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Old 06-08-2006, 01:46 PM
gandini gandini is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iDiaz
...
It's paint that changes color when a certain temperature has been reached, so you know what temperature your rotors are reaching during braking, not after you've driven for a bit and pulled over.
How do you do that? Get someone to run alongside the car as it's braking into a corner downhill, and look at the paint color? Wouldn't you still have to pull over and take a look?
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Old 06-08-2006, 02:30 PM
battle cattle battle cattle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gandini
How do you do that? Get someone to run alongside the car as it's braking into a corner downhill, and look at the paint color? Wouldn't you still have to pull over and take a look?
What he is saying is that the paint changes color instantly... and stays... You paint the caliper/rotor/whatever before you start. Then the paint reacts as you are driving and even if you cool your brakes the paint will still stay changed. So you can look afterward at what the real temp was... and not a cooled down version.

-Josh

and an FYI...we also use this in welding to monitor the heat input in the basemetal if its gettign to hot you have to move faster too cool you need to slow down. We use the same process with much cooler paints... 300-600ish (depending on metal)
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Old 06-08-2006, 05:04 PM
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Yup, what battle cattle said. Once the paint reaches its target temperature and changes color, it doesn't change back.
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Old 06-10-2006, 04:22 PM
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Default I totally forgot about temp paints...

Good idea! Cheap and effective. Put some of that on and have at it. Cheaper than a good temp gun and just requires a bit of elbow grease.

So yeah, what he said ...

Alternately, if your calipers are already painted that cracks off at ~1100 degrees typically...
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  #15  
Old 06-12-2006, 07:33 PM
Abattoir Abattoir is offline
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ugh found out that when my brakes get up to that heat range they have a shudder that feels like a warped rotor... and at lower speeds it feels like brake fade, some say it feels like "gassing out" >_>

i feel weird that i'm the only one with an accord on this forum.
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